I know its been done, but nothing like some old topics and new perspectives to get me going

Personally, I like to take all aspects into account. Era they played in reflecting their points. Their competition faced when winning Norris trophies, how good their teams were, etc
I do not consider Stanley cups to be a great measure of a defenseman. Its a team trophy, and some guys won it when 6 teams were in the league, others played in a watered down league on crappy teams where winning was harder.

It is impossible to compare certain defensemen because their era's were so different I know. usually, we judge them based on how they dominated their peers.

My top 10 all time NHL Defenseman List.

#1 Orr
#2 Shore
#3 Harvey
#4 Bourque
#5 Potvin
#6 Lidstrom
#7 Robinson
#8 Park
#9 Red Kelly
#10 Chelios


The top 4 are the only 4 set in stone though.

1. Orr: the best offensive defenseman ever (only blueliner to win the Art Ross), excellent playoff performer (2 Conn Smythes), excellent defensive play, 8 Norrises, 3 Harts; no weakness in any part of his game

2. Shore: 4 Hart trophies, best offensive defenseman of his era, great defensive player; violent, tough and aggressive; would have probably won 7 or 8 Norrises had they been around when he played

3. Harvey: arguably the best defensive player and penalty killer ever; slowed the game to a crawl or sped it up with great breakout passes as needed; won 7 Norris trophies in 8 years; 5-time Hart finalist; 11-time all-star.

4. Bourque: perhaps the best example of consistent excellence on the blueline; won 5 Norrises; despite not winning the Cup with Boston, he was an excellent playoff performer; people severly underrate how tough and aggressive Bourque was in his prime. Bourque had a higher peak value than Lidstrom (his 1990 season was probably the best by a defenseman in the past 20 years) and has more longevity (he was first, second or third for the Norris in FIFTEEN different seasons and was a 19-time all-star


The rest is debatable

5. Potvin: excellent defensive player; a tough, aggressive checker and fighter; excellent goal-scoring and playmaking; captained the Islanders to four Stanley Cups; won 3 Norrises. 8-time all-star and 2-time Hart finalist.

6. Lidstrom. Excellent playoff performer; plays excellent defense despite not being a physical player (like Kelly); the top offensive defenseman of the past decade; has a Conn Smythe and 4 (soon to be 5?) Norrises

7. Robinson: the #1 defenseman on (arguably) the greatest team in NHL history. His toughness and checking abilities are underrated; very dangerous on the powerplay and rock solid in his own zone. Has a Conn Smythe and two Norrises.

8. Park: the only reason he doesn't have FOUR Norrises is because his prime coincided with Orr's. Famous for his crushing hip-checks. Very good defensively, an aggressive hitter, and a great goal-scorer.

9. Red Kelly: the top offensive defenseman of his era; very similar to Lidstrom in that both were excellent playmakers, played excellent defense despite not being physical or aggressive, and both stayed out of the penalty box. An 8-time all-star and (this is where he gets the edge on Lidstrom) a four-time finalist for the Hart

10. Chelios: incredible how much he gets underrated here. Did people forget him carrying the Hawks singlehandedly to the Cup finals in 1992? (It was one of the top playoff runs by a defenseman I've ever seen). Chelios was a good offensive player in his prime, was arguably the best defensive player in the league (he could shut down practically anyone), and was extremely tough and aggressive. Three Norrises don't hurt either.

I'd say Coffey and Pilote are the next two; after that, I think there are at least 6 or 7 different players who have a legitimate shot at the next couple of positions. I'll also say that the top four are in a league of their own; and spots 7-10 are very close.
Fetisov gets a huge jump into the top 10 if you consider his non NHL years as well.

Great list, great choices. I think I'd swap out Red Kelly though for maybe Pierre Pilote or Harry Howell, mostly because most fans know Leonard as a leafs centre that served as a MP.

What about Neids? I think he deserves to be there just as much as Lidstrom, I mean he didn't win as many Norris'. But he has accomplished just as much or more than him. Lidstrom is a bigger point getter, I think they are probably equal defensively, maybe even Neids being better.
Then again, I guess the Norris' do speak pretty loudly, seeing that all those years he won them Norris' Neids was playing too, and wasn't picked.

scott steven should be in there too

zubov should be a solid 5 ludwieg at least a 7 and stevens should definitely be there he is way better then harvey or shore

I can only go with the players i have seen and not judge by stats

1.Scott Stevens
2.Sergei Zubov
3.Niklas Lidstrom
4.Brad Park
5.Larry Robinson
6.Paul Coffey
7.Craig Hartsburg
8.Mark Howe
9.Ray Bourque
10.Al MacInnis